This is NOT a new world

It is NOT a new world. What we are experiencing is just the maturing of the old world, the winter phase of a social engineering process that was based on false assumptions, substantially contrary to the American experience, which at that time was the envy of the world. What is truly amazing is the longevity of the experiment before its ultimate demise became self-evident, though stubbornly denied by many. Some people habitually ask,

Along the lines of rising from the ashes: I look for this nation to eventually fail. We will be unable to pay our debts and our currency will fail. When our currency fails our government will lose all power. After all, military and police will have to be paid so they can eat. I look for civil wars and gang violence in the streets of Anytown USA. Third world violence we only see on tv will come to reality here. The right to bear arms will become obvious since it will be needed to protect you and your family and possessions not just from gangs but from government.

Hopefully in the end a new nation will emerge that will follow the constitution not just in word but in spirit.

Joel, you brought up specific thoughts which I had not wanted to mention but,it is not easy to disagree with your prognosis. Our government, especially the executive branch has become very powerful and has heralded its intention" to do whatever it takes" to enforce its agenda, regardless of any other considerations. Let’s hope that our problems will not be solved by the historical approaches of putting the blame on others and thereby justifying a military war. During my adult lifetime, I have firmly believed that every human being had only one enemy to fear: his own government, not that of others. I am glad to have you on my side of the barricade.

I don’t agree with anything you just said. I will never fight my government or it’s people. I will defend my family and property to the death with out pause. 3 of my 5 kids are vets and I am very proud of this fact

Tnis is a global collapse and can’t be blamed on any entity. I never refused free money 6 years ago or 5% mortgages. I was as avaricious as any and I don’t blame anyone for what is going on.

I believe I’m gonna make some money out of all this…I just haven’t figured out how…yet.

There are billions sitting out there waiting to be picked up…I need to be smart enough or stubborn enough to find a way to do this.

banks have never been my friend and I have seen several creative sales that didn’t require one. enough people snap to this and maybe Banks don’t play such a pivotal role in business.

I read Atlas Shrugged last winter by Ayn Rand and Ayn saw this coming like 50 years ago. Maybe we will become like this.

I love that woman and this quote from her in 1957:

The question isn’t who is going to let me; it’s who is going to stop me.

You go girl…I’d love to have met her.

Regards all,


How can you say that you are not willing to ever fight this country or it’s people and then say that you will defend your family and property with your life.? What will you do when the government takes your property?

Now Uncle Sam is smart. He will not come to your door with a pointed gun but he will slowly but surely take your right to have a door and most certainly a gun. We in this country are like the old story of the frog in water that eventually gets boiled to death.

How about the SAFE act that currently has everyone in a tizzy? What business does the government have in a business between you and your buyer? But that is just another law that has been piled upon us one at a time. How many new laws will be passed this year by Congress and the States. Each one robs someone of rights. Just think of how many have been passed in your lifetime.

Greg, I really did not mean this to escallate into a political discussion. You should be proud that your sons have served this country. I am grateful for all of our veterans. We really have no idea of the sacrifice that they have made for this country. I just hate to see the freedoms that were fought for by our forefathers in the revolution and both world wars looted by the greed and sloth of our government and the electorate.

This thought about the SAFE act is exactly what I thought, listening in GA to everyone go on and on about you have to know about it to make sure you abide by it. I kept thinking to myself “The real goal should be to ignore it and tell the politicians they have no right!” Of course, I snapped back to my pen and paper and wrote down what I might need to know.

Who knows where we will end up through all of this. I’m thankful my father taught me how to work, using both my brain and my hands. The ride should be interesting, I just hope not too bad for my young son.


What I said is I will never fight my government or the people in the government. Maybe in court never with a weapon.

As far as thirld world thuggery by gangs on my properties? Bring it on. There are over 170M REGISTERED weapons in this Country…I have a few.

This is IMHO paroania at is worst. We are a nation of laws. If we don’t agree with them we have social constructs in place to remove these laws or modify them. We are not a nation of thugs.

Something like 90% of ALL crimes are comitted by less than 10% of our population.

As Americans we will never revert to tribal law. We are a nation of laws.

I don’t agree with Iraq but I willingly allowed my oldest daughter to do a 15 month tour there during the invasion no less.

Governments like ours don’t go postal Joe…they print more money. And with the Iraq oilfields under our control we are one of the very few Nations that can be made self sustaining. We can feed all our people using our agriculture.

To think there will be rioting in the streets is just wrong…we are capitalists not anarchists!

Gimmeabreak Joe LOL




Usually we are of the same thoughts but on this one I have to disagree. I can see us slipping into a country of thugs a lot easier than most would think. Laws are only effective in a civil society and it does not take that long for a civil society to break down under the right conditions, even our own.

I am a big history buff and I can tell you that every civlization has eventually broken down and so to will ours at some point. The question is only when and how? I am not a pessimist at all on this and doubt it will come to pass in most of our lifetimes, BUT I also believe in planning for the worst while hoping for the best.

Glad someone else brought this up as it is something I have contemplated lately with all that I have been seeing in society currently. There are certainly signs out there that things could be heading in that direction. I am not really harping on it but I have put some contingency plans in place and plan on being prepared as much as I can without changing my life now.



As a history buff I wonder if you have thought of the correlation between today and the time of the revolution. "We’, being the colonists took up arms against the established government. We were crimminals. We were against someone telling us what to do and to think while taking our money in the process.

Is our taxation really bringing us representation? Most all of our elected officials at the federal level are either wealthy or have sold their souls to gainn office. This country was set up with the model of strong states and a weaker federal government. Local officials were men of character that actually had the power to make a difference. Today the feds have all the money through taxation and printing presses and use this as a club on the states and locals. The states have to go along with the feds because the feds control all of the money. Thus the rights of the states are dimminished I call for a return of the Constitution not only in word but in spirit and practice.

Post Edited (02-08-10 18:20)

Funny you should bring that up Joel because in a moment of reflection a few weeks ago I actually wrote up an analysis for this very thing. I really do not want to continue on this subject much more because I do feel it counterproductive to the true intent of this forum, however I will include that analysis for review since you brought it up (again this is just my opinion and if it offends then please remove):

The possibility of a true coup de grace, an overthrow of the current American government seems now more possible than ever. However saying that it still seems like a foggy nightmare